King Charles III creates his son Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester

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and Prince and Great Steward of Scotland, Baron of Renfrew, Duke of Cornwall, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, King Charles III, Lord of the Isles, Prince George of Wales, Prince Louis of Wales, Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester, Prince William, Princess Charlotte of Wales

During the King’s address to the nation he created the Duke of Cornwall and Cambridge Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester.

HM King Charles III of the United Kingdom

Thier Royal Highnesses The Prince and Princesses of Wales

Upon his father’s accession to the throne yesterday William, as eldest son of the Sovereign and heir apparent, automatically received the additional titles of Duke of Cornwall, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Baron of Renfrew, Lord of the Isles, and Prince and Great Steward of Scotland. Today, September 9, 2022, the King announced the appointment of William as Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester.

The Prince and Princess of Wales and thier Children: Prince George of Wales, Prince Louis of Wales and Princess Charlotte of Wales

His wife now becomes HRH The Princess of Wales and thier children Prince George, Princess Charlotte and Prince Louis lose their territorial designation “of Cornwall and Cambridge” and will now adopt the territorial designation “of Wales” becoming Prince George of Wales, Princess Charlotte of Wales and Prince Louis of Wales respectively.

April 19, 1390: Death of Robert II of Scotland

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Earl of Carrick, High Steward of Scotland, House of Stewart, Robert I of Scotland, Robert II of Scotland, Robert the Bruce, Walter Stewart

King Robert I of Scotland died on June 7, 1329 at the Manor of Cardross, near Dumbarton. Upon the death of Robert I the Bruce of Scotland he was David succeeded on the throne by his son David II at the age of five, and was crowned at Scone in November 1331, becoming the first Scottish monarch to be anointed at their coronation.

David II died childless on February 22, 1371 and was succeeded by his nephew as King Robert II of Scotland. Robert II (March 1316 – April 19, 1390) was the son of Walter Stewart, 6th High Steward of Scotland and Marjorie, daughter of King Robert I, he was the first monarch of the House of Stewart.

Robert II depicted on his great seal

King David II was buried at Holyrood Abbey and almost immediately an armed protest was lead by William, Earl of Douglas delayed Robert II’s coronation until 26 March 26, 1371.

The reasons for the incident remain unclear but may have involved a dispute regarding Robert’s right of succession, or may have been directed against George Dunbar, Earl of March (also known as Earl of Dunbar) and the southern Justiciar, Robert Erskine.

It was resolved by Robert giving his daughter Isabella in marriage to Douglas’s son, James and with Douglas replacing Erskine as Justiciar south of the Forth.

Robert’s accession did affect some others who held offices from David II. In particular, George Dunbar’s brother John Dunbar, the Lord of Fife who lost his claim on Fife and Sir Robert Erskine’s son, Sir Thomas Erskine who lost control of Edinburgh Castle.

The Stewarts greatly increased their holdings in the west, in Atholl, and in the far north: the earldoms of Fife and Menteith went to Robert II’s second surviving son, Robert; the earldoms of Buchan and Ross (along with the lordship of Badenoch) to his fourth son, Alexander; and the earldoms of Strathearn and Caithness to the eldest son of his second marriage, David.

King Robert’s sons-in-law were John MacDonald, Lord of the Isles, John Dunbar, Earl of Moray and James who would become the 2nd Earl of Douglas. Robert’s sons John, Earl of Carrick, the king’s heir, and Robert, Earl of Fife, were made keepers of the castles of Edinburgh and Stirling respectively, while Alexander, Lord of Badenoch and Ross, and were usually very well rewarded.

This style of kingship was very different from his predecessor’s—David tried to dominate his nobles whereas Robert’s strategy was to delegate authority to his powerful sons and earls and this generally worked for the first decade of his reign. Robert II was to have influence over eight of the fifteen earldoms either through his sons directly or by strategic marriages of his daughters to powerful lords.

In 1336, he first married Elizabeth Mure (died 1355), daughter of Sir Adam Mure of Rowallan. The marriage was criticized for being uncanonical, so he remarried her in 1349 after receiving a papal dispensation in 1347.

From this union, ten children reached adulthood including John (died 1406), who became King of Scotland as Robert III.

In 1355, Robert married his second wife Euphemia de Ross (died 1387), daughter of Hugh, Earl of Ross. They had four children including Walter Stewart, Earl of Atholl, born about 1360, who was beheaded at Edinburgh in 1437 for being involved in the assassination of King James I of Scotland.

King Robert II also had many illegitimate children with several mistresses, including four sons with his favorite Mariota de Cardeny, daughter of Sir John Cardeny, and widow of Alexander Mac Naugthon.

Robert’s son, John, Earl of Carrick, had become the foremost Stewart magnate south of the Forth just as Alexander Stewart, Earl of Buchan was in the north. The Earl of Buchan, (1343 – c. 20 July 1405), was the third surviving son of King Robert II of Scotland and youngest by his first wife, Elizabeth Mure of Rowallan.

Alexander’s activities and methods of royal administration, enforced by Gaelic mercenaries, drew criticism from northern earls and bishops and from his younger half-brother David, Earl of Strathearn. These complaints damaged the king’s standing within the Council leading to criticism of his ability to curb Buchan’s activities.

Robert III’s differences with the Carrick affinity regarding the conduct of the war and his continued failure or unwillingness to deal with Buchan in the north led to the political convulsion of November 1384 when the Council removed the king’s authority to govern and appointed Carrick as lieutenant of the kingdom—a coup d’état had taken place.

With Robert III sidelined, there was now no impediment in the way of war. In June 1385, a force of 1200 French soldiers joined the Scots in a campaign that involved the Earl of Douglas and two of Robert’s sons, John, Earl of Carrick and Robert, Earl of Fife. The skirmishes saw small gains but a quarrel between the French and Scottish commanders saw the abandonment of an attack on the important castle of Roxburgh.

The victory of the Scots over the English at the Battle of Otterburn in Northumberland in August 1388 set in motion Carrick’s fall from power. One of the Scottish casualties was Carrick’s close ally James, Earl of Douglas.

Douglas died without an heir, which led to various claims upon the title and estate—Carrick backed Malcolm Drummond, the husband of Douglas’s sister, while Fife sided with the successful appellant, Sir Archibald Douglas, lord of Galloway who possessed an entail on the Douglas estates.

Fife, now with his powerful Douglas ally, and those who supported the king ensured a countercoup at the December Council meeting when the guardianship of Scotland passed from Carrick (who had recently been badly injured from a horse-kick) to Fife. Many had also approved of Fife’s intention to properly resolve the situation of lawlessness in the north and in particular the activities of his younger brother, Buchan.

Fife relieved Buchan of his offices of lieutenant of the north and justiciar north of the Forth. The latter role was given to Fife’s son, Murdoch Stewart. Robert II toured the northeast of the kingdom in late January 1390, perhaps to reinforce the changing political scene in the north following Buchan’s removal from authority. In March, Robert returned to Dundonald Castle in Ayrshire where he died on April 19 and was buried at Scone on April 25th.

March 25, 1306: Coronation of Robert the Bruce as King of Scots.

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Battle of Bannockburn, coronation, Earl of Carrick, Edward I of England, Elizabeth de Burgh, Isabella of Mar, King Edward II of England, Pope John XXII, Robert I of Scotland, Robert the Bruce, Stone of Destiny, Stone of Scone, William Wallace

Robert I (July 11, 1274 – June 7, 1329), popularly known as Robert the Bruce was King of Scotland from 1306 until his death in 1329. Robert was one of the most famous warriors of his generation, and eventually led Scotland during the First War of Scottish Independence against England. He fought successfully during his reign to regain Scotland’s place as an independent country and is today revered in Scotland as a national hero.

Several members of the Bruce family were called Robert, the future king was one of ten children, and the eldest son, of Robert de Brus, 6th Lord of Annandale, and Marjorie, Countess of Carrick, and claimed the Scottish throne as a fourth great-grandson of David I of Scotland. His mother was by all accounts a formidable woman who, legend would have it, kept Robert Bruce’s father captive until he agreed to marry her. From his mother, he inherited the Earldom of Carrick, and through his father, a royal lineage that would give him a claim to the Scottish throne. The Bruces also held substantial estates in Aberdeenshire, County Antrim, County Durham, Essex, Middlesex and Yorkshire.

Robert’s grandfather, Robert de Brus, 5th Lord of Annandale, was one of the claimants to the Scottish throne during the “Great Cause”. As Earl of Carrick, Robert the Bruce supported his family’s claim to the Scottish throne and took part in William Wallace’s revolt against Edward I of England. Appointed in 1298 as a Guardian of Scotland alongside his chief rival for the throne, John III Comyn, Lord of Badenoch, and William Lamberton, Bishop of St Andrews, Robert later resigned in 1300 due to his quarrels with Comyn and the apparently imminent restoration of John Balliol to the Scottish throne. After submitting to Edward I in 1302 and returning to “the king’s peace”, Robert inherited his family’s claim to the Scottish throne upon his father’s death.

It is not known exactly when Robert married his first wife, Isabella of Mar, the daughter of Domhnall I, Earl of Mar and his wife Helen. It is theorized to have taken place in the early 1290s. Isabella died in 1296 before her husband was crowned King of Scotland. Six years after Isabella’s death, Robert married his second wife, Elizabeth de Burgh (died 1327). Robert and Isabella’s daughter, Marjorie, married Walter Stewart, Steward of Scotland, and their son eventually reigned as Robert II, King of Scotland (died 1390).

In February 1306, Bruce, having wounded Comyn, rushed from the church where they had met and encountered his attendants outside. He told them what had happened and said, “I must be off, for I doubt I have slain the Red Comyn.” “Doubt?”, Roger de Kirkpatrick of Closeburn answered. “I mak sikker,” (“I’ll make sure,” or “I make sure”). Kirkpatrick then rushed into the church and killed Comyn. For this, Bruce was then excommunicated by the Pope (although he received absolution from Robert Wishart, Bishop of Glasgow).

Bruce moved quickly to seize the throne, and was crowned king of Scots on March 25, 1306. Edward I’s forces defeated Robert in battle, forcing him to flee into hiding before re-emerging in 1307 to defeat an English army at Loudoun Hill and wage a highly successful guerrilla war against the English. Bruce defeated his other Scots enemies, destroying their strongholds and devastating their lands, and in 1309 held his first parliament.

A series of military victories between 1310 and 1314 won him control of much of Scotland, and at the Battle of Bannockburn in 1314, Robert defeated a much larger English army under Edward II of England, confirming the re-establishment of an independent Scottish kingdom. The battle marked a significant turning point, with Robert’s armies now free to launch devastating raids throughout northern England, while also extending his war against the English to Ireland by sending an army to invade there and by appealing to the Irish to rise against Edward II’s rule.

Despite Bannockburn and the capture of the final English stronghold at Berwick in 1318, Edward II refused to renounce his claim to the overlordship of Scotland. In 1320, the Scottish nobility submitted the Declaration of Arbroath to Pope John XXII, declaring Robert as their rightful monarch and asserting Scotland’s status as an independent kingdom. In 1324, the Pope recognised Robert I as king of an independent Scotland, and in 1326, the Franco-Scottish alliance was renewed in the Treaty of Corbeil. In 1327, the English deposed Edward II in favour of his son, Edward III, and peace was concluded between Scotland and England with the Treaty of Edinburgh-Northampton in 1328, by which Edward III renounced all claims to sovereignty over Scotland.

Robert died in June 1329. His body is buried in Dunfermline Abbey, while his heart was interred in Melrose Abbey and his internal organs embalmed and placed in St Serf’s Chapel, Dumbarton, site of the medieval Cardross Parish church.

History of the Titles of the Prince of Wales: Part IX

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Baron of Renfrew, British Peerage, Earl of Carrick, James I of Scotland, Lords of Parliament, Prince Charles, Prince of Wales, Scottish Peerage

Since the history of one the titles of the Prince of Wales is rather short today I’ll include two for the price of one!

Baron of Renfrew is a title held by the heir apparent to the British throne. It was held by the Scottish heir apparent beginning in 1404 when it was bestowed on the future King James I of Scotland. It is closely associated with the title Duke of Rothesay. An act of the Scottish Parliament passed in 1469 confirmed the pattern of succession of attaching the Barony of Renfrew with the heir to the Scottish crown. Renfrew is a town near Glasgow, is sometimes called the “cradle of the royal Stewarts.”

HRH The Baron of Renfrew and Earl of Carrick.

In Scotland, the title of Baron is a feudal titles, not peerages: a Scottish Lord of Parliament equates to an English or British baron. There is a debate however if the Barony of Renfrew is actually a peerage title. Some historians claim that the Act of 1469 elevated the Barony of Renfrew to the dignity of a peerage when it officially attached the Barony to the other peerage titles connected to the heir to the Scottish Crown. Other historians suggest that the barony became a peerage upon the Union of the Crowns in 1603. Finally, some scholars argue that the uncertainty surrounding the text of the 1469 Act leaves the barony as only a feudal dignity, not a peerage dignity. The title of Lord Renfrew was used by the traveling Prince of Wales, later King Edward VII and Prince Edward, Duke of Rothesay, later King Edward VIII and Duke of Windsor, when he traveled in a private capacity or when he wished to pay visits incognito.

Earl of Carrick or Mormaer of Carrick is the title applied to the ruler of Carrick (now southern Ayrshire), subsequently part of the Peerage of Scotland. The position came to be strongly associated with the Scottish crown when Robert the Bruce, who had inherited it from his maternal kin, became King of the Scotland in the early 14th century. Since the 15th century the title of Earl of Carrick has automatically been held by the heir apparent to the throne, meaning Prince Charles is the current Earl.

The earldom emerged in 1186, out of the old Lordship of Galloway, which had previously encompassed all of what is now known as Galloway as well as the southern part of Ayrshire. Though the Lords of Galloway recognised the King of Scotland as their overlord, their lordship was effectively a separate kingdom, and had its own laws.

The first Lord of Carrick recorded is Fergus, who died in 1161 leaving two sons: Uchtred and Gille Brigte (Gilbert). As was the custom then, the two brothers shared the lordship and the lands between them. In 1174, they joined with King William I the Lion of Scotland in his invasion of Northumberland. During the invasion King William was taken prisoner by the English, the Galwegians broke into rebellion. Uchtred remained loyal to the Scottish king, while Gille Brigte took control of the entirety of Galloway. Uchtred was savagely murdered by Gille Brigte and his son Máel Coluim. In 1175, King William was restored to liberty, and he marched an army into Galloway to bring justice upon Gille Brigte. However, he seems to have contented himself with exacting a fine, leaving Gille Brigte to go unharmed.

In 1176, Gille Brigte obtained an agreement with King Henry II of England, in which he became his vassal; in exchange, he paid the English king the then enormous sum of £919 and gave his son Duncan (Donnchadh) as a hostage. Gille Brigte then spent the next decade carrying out devastating raids on King William’s territory, with the protection of the English.

Gille Brigte’s death in 1185 created general turmoil amongst the Galwegians. Roland, son of the murdered Uchtred, defeated the supporters of Gille Brigte in 1185, and planted forts across Galloway to secure his authority. This angered King Henry II and he marched a large force to Carlisle in preparation for invasion. However, war was averted at a meeting between Roland, William I of Scotland and Henry II of England, where it was agreed that Roland would rule the main part of Galloway, while Gille Brigte’s son Duncan would rule the northern section, known as Carrick. Duncan agreed to these terms, and renounced all claims to the Lordship of Galloway, becoming the first Earl of Carrick.

Duncan married Avelina, daughter of Alan, High Steward of Scotland. His son or grandson Niall’s eldest daughter Marjorie succeeded him, becoming Countess of Carrick in her own right. She married firstly Adam de Kilconquhar. In 1269, Adam journeyed to the Holy Land under the banners of King Louis IX of France, as part of the Eighth Crusade. He never returned, dying of disease at Acre in 1270. The next year, the widowed Countess happened to meet Robert de Brus hunting in her lands. According to legend, Marjorie imprisoned Robert until he agreed to marry her. They were married at Turnberry Castle, without their families’ knowledge or the requisite consent of the King. When news got out, Alexander III seized her castles and estates, but she later atoned for her foolishness with a fine, and Robert was recognised as her husband and Earl of Carrick jure uxoris.; They had five sons and five daughters: Robert, Edward, Thomas, Alexander, Nigel, Isabel, Mary, Christina, Matilda and Margaret.

Royal earls

Marjorie and Robert were succeeded by their eldest son. When the old House of Dunkeld became extinct, this Robert, known as “the Bruce”, became a principal candidate for the throne as the great-great-great-great grandson of David I. He was crowned at Scone in 1306, causing his titles (Earl of Carrick, Lord of Annandale and Baron Bruce in the Peerage of England) to merge into the Crown. It would take more creations of the title before it became associated with the heir to the Scottish throne.

Around 1313, King Robert created his younger brother Edward, the Earl of Carrick. Edward had no issue, save a natural son, Alexander, he had by Lady Isabella Strathbogie, daughter of John, Earl of Atholl. The title therefore became extinct on his death at the Battle of Faughart in 1318.

After briefly being held by Robert’s son David prior to his accession to the throne, the title was granted in 1332 to Alexander, Edward’s bastard. However, Alexander was killed the next year at the Battle of Halidon Hill and the title once again became extinct.

In 1368, King David created his great-nephew John Stewart the Earl of Carrick. David died unexpectedly in 1371. He had no children, meaning he was succeeded by his nephew Robert Stewart, John’s father. After Robert’s death in 1390, John succeeded him, taking the regnal name Robert III; thus the Earldom of Carrick again merged with the Crown.

The title was next held by Robert III’s son David, who was also created Duke of Rothesay and Earl of Atholl. David died childless in 1402, and the Earldom was regranted to his brother James; however he was generally known by the higher title Prince or Steward of Scotland. James acceded to the throne in 1406, and his titles merged with the Crown.

In 1469, the Scottish Parliament passed an Act declaring that the eldest son of the King and heir to the throne would automatically hold the Earldom of Carrick along with the Dukedom of Rothesay. After the Union of the Crowns of Scotland and England, the Dukedom and Earldom have been held by the eldest son and heir apparent of the kings and queens of Great Britain. Thus Prince Charles is the current Duke of Rothesay and Earl of Carrick.

Stewart earls (1628)

Despite the Earldom of Carrick being connected to the Duke of Rothesay and therefore the heir to the throne a separate Earldom of Carrick was created for an illegitimate scion of the House of Stuart/Stuart.

In 1628, King Charles I created John Stewart the Earl of Carrick. He had already been made Lord Kincleven in 1607, also in the Peerage of Scotland. Stewart was a younger son of Robert, Earl of Orkney, bastard son of King James V; thus he was Charles’s half-great-uncle. This title was deemed not to conflict with the Earldom of Carrick held by the heir to the throne, as it referred not to the province in Ayrshire, but to the lands of Carrick on Eday in Orkney. John married Lady Elizabeth Southwell, daughter of Charles Howard, Earl of Nottingham and widow of Sir Robert Southwell. By her he had one daughter, Margaret. He is also known to have had two natural children: a son, named Henry, and a daughter, whose name is unknown. As he had no legitimate son, his titles became extinct on his death around 1645.

The Titles of the Prince of Wales

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Baron of Renfrew, Duke of Cornwall, Duke Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Edward the Black Prince, Frederick Prince of Wales, Great Steward of Scotland, HRH The Prince of Wales, Kings and Queens of England, Kings and Queens of Great Britain, kings and queens of Scotland, kings and queens of the United Kingdom, Lord of the Isles

This post is to announce the new series I am working on.

HRH The Prince of Wales

The heir to the throne of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland holds the title Prince of Wales. However, A Prince of Wales also holds a number of additional titles. As heir apparent to the English/British throne he is—if the eldest living son of the monarch—Duke of Cornwall. As heir apparent to the Scottish throne he is Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Baron of Renfrew, Lord of the Isles, and Prince and Great Steward of Scotland.

HRH Prince Frederick-Louis, Prince of Wales and Duke of Edinburgh

In my new series my plan is to take each title, Prince, Duke, Earl, Baron and Steward and to discuss the evolution and history of those specific titles. Once that is completed I will move on to discuss, individually, the evolution and history behind the specific titles Prince of Wales, Duke of Cornwall, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Baron of Renfrew, Lord of the Isles, and Prince and Great Steward of Scotland.

Edward the Black Prince, Prince of Wales

I believe this will be an informative and interesting series!!

Death of King Robert III of Scotland.

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David II of Scotland, Duke of Albany, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Henry IV, Henry IV of England, House of Stuart, James I of Scotland, Kings and Queens of England, kings and queens of Scotland, Robert III of Scotland, Robert the Bruce

On this date in History. April 4, 1406. Death of King Robert III of Scotland.

Robert III (c.1337/40 – April 4, 1406), born John Stewart, was King of Scots from 1390 to his death. He was known primarily as John, Earl of Carrick before ascending the throne. He was the eldest son of Robert II and Elizabeth Mure and was legitimated with the marriage of his parents in 1347.

In 1368 David II, King of Scots created John Earl of Carrick. His father became king Robert II in 1371 after the unexpected death of the childless King David II. Robert II’s claim to the throne of Scotland was as the nephew of David II and also as a grand son of Robert I (Robert the Bruce). Robert II was the son of the son of Walter Stewart, 6th High Steward of Scotland and of Marjorie Bruce, daughter of the Scottish king Robert the Bruce by his first wife Isabella of Mar. This made Robert II the first Scottish king of the House of Stewart (Stuart)*

John Stewart, Earl of Carrick was influential in the government of the kingdom but became progressively more impatient at his father’s longevity. The Earl of CarrickRobert II died at Dundonald Castle in Ayrshire on April 19, 1390 and was buried at Scone on April 25. The Earl of Carrick was 53 years old when he ascended the Scottish throne.

In May 1390 the Scottish Parliament granted John permission to change his regnal name to Robert III probably in part to maintain the link back to Robert I but also to disassociate himself from unpopular King John Balliol.

In 1367 Robert III, then Earl of Carrick, married Annabella Drummond the daughter of Sir John Drummond, 11th Thane of Lennox and Mary Montifex, daughter of Sir William Montifex. They had seven children. The heir to the throne was David Stewart (24 October 1378 – 26 March 1402). He was the first Duke of Rothesay from 1398. He was named after his great-great-uncle, David II of Scotland, and also held the titles of Earl of Atholl (1398–1402) and Earl of Carrick (1390–1402).

In late February 1402, while travelling officially to St Andrews, David was arrested just outside the city at Strathtyrum in a sting operation which had been arranged by Robert Stewart, Duke of Albany (c. 1340 – 3 September 1420), the younger brother of Robert III, King of Scots a ruthless politician. The Duke of Albany, at that time in complicit alliance with Archibald, fourth Earl of Douglas. (David’s father-in-law, the highly influential third Earl, had died two years before, in 1400.) concocted the pretext for David’s arrest was that his lieutenancy had expired. He was initially held captive in St Andrews Castle, and soon afterwards taken to Falkland Palace, Albany’s residence in Fife. At Falkland David remained a prisoner and shortly died there, reputedly of starvation. A few weeks later, in May 1402, a public enquiry into the circumstances of David’s death exonerated Albany of all blame.

Following David, the Duke of Rothesay’s death, and with the restoration of the lieutenancy to Albany and the Scottish defeat at the battle of Humbleton, Robert III experienced almost total exclusion from political authority and was limited to his lands in the west.

By October 28, 1405 Robert III had returned to Dundonald Castle in Ayrshire. With the king’s health failing, it was decided in the winter of 1405–6 to send the young prince James, now heir to the throne after his brothers death, to France out of the reach of the Duke of Albany. On March 22, 1406 the ship was taken by English pirates off Flamborough Head, who delivered James to King Henry IV of England. Robert III had moved to Rothesay Castle where, after hearing of his son’s captivity, died on April 4, 1406, and was buried in Paisley Abbey, which had been founded by the Stewarts.

James Stewart, succeeded Robert III as James I, King of Scots (although at that time remaining uncrowned and in captivity in England) while the Duke of Albany secured himself as de facto ruler of Scotland.

* Stewart was the original spelling for the name of the Royal House. It was after the reign of Mary I, Queen of Scots and her time in France did the spelling of the Royal House change to Stuart, the French form of the name.

Is Royalty a Controversial and Complicated subject?

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Duke and Duchess of Cambridge, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Earl of Chester, High Steward of Scotland, King George VI, Kings and Queens of England, kings and queens of Scotland, kings and queens of the United Kingdom, Merge with the crown, Prince Charles, Prince Harry, Prince Henry of Wales, Prince of Wales, Prince Philip, Princess Beatrice, Princess Elizabeth of York, Proper usage of titles, The Duke of Edinburgh, The Queen, titles

You would think this was harmless and fun without much controversy… but you’d be wrong!! You wouldn’t know it from reading the comments on this blog because they are 99% very positive. However, I also run my own royal history page on Facebook (link below) and while that page is also pretty civil you will see some squabbling from time to time. If you’re on Facebook you can follow that page if you’d like.

https://www.facebook.com/EuropeanRoyalHistory

I would to mention a few of my observations to why discussing royalty can be controversial.

1. First of all not everyone is following royalty for the same reasons. Plus, some peoples interest in the topic may not be as deep or as intense as others which lead me to this observation. Before I relate what it is I want to say, I imply no judgment at all. It seems there are two groups of people that are interested in royalty. One group, I call royalty watchers, follow royalty like they would follow any celebrity, be they an actor or an actress, singer or musician or sports figure. Often, as I have observed, many of these types of royalty watchers began watching royalty due to the influence of Diana, Princess of Wales. Therefore, there interest may be limited to The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge and Prince Harry of Wales, and may be extended to the Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh and other immediate members of the British Royal Family. But there is a limited focus and interest.

2. The other group that are interested in royalty are like myself, they are more of an historian than royalty as celebrity watcher. That means often our knowledge and interest is not just with the British Monarchy (although it may be our favorite) or the current British Royal Family; our interests stretch far back into history and across all monarchies of Europe and even the world. Again, both groups are fine. If you’re interest is not that deep, whatever level you enjoy royalty is fine!

The problem, as I have observed, these two groups often clash.

3. It seems as if they clash over two areas. These two areas are Diana, Princess of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall (Camilla) and the knowledge and usage of titles and correctly addressing the members of the royal family. I apologize for generalizing the situation so if you don’t fit in these categories I understand. It seems the more historical minded people have no problem accepting the Duchess of Cornwall (Camilla) into the royal family and seeing her one day being queen along side her husband, future King Charles III. The more casual royalty watcher, those that began watching royalty due to the influence of Diana, Princess of Wales, tend to still hold Diana in very high esteem and cannot stand either the Prince of Wales or the Duchess of Cornwall (Camilla) very much. With some there is outright hated. So that can be a controversial topic and an area of conflict.

Another topic that is surprisingly controversial is the usage of titles. Now, I must admit the proper usage of styles and titles is a bit confusing and can take a while to learn, but it can be done. I have found that the more historically minded the royalty watcher they generally do know this information. What I see in the casual royalty enthusiasts can be divided into three categories: a) There are those who do not understand the proper usage of titles or the laws governing how titles are created and inherited and what happens to some of them when the heir to the throne becomes the sovereign or the title becomes extinct. This group is eager to learn about these things. b) The second group may have some knowledge on the subject but they are grossly misinformed and are often wrong. I find this group to be a challenge to deal with because they often do not like to be corrected when they’re wrong and will often stubbornly cling to their misinformation. c) That last group are the very casual royalty watcher who could care less about this topic!

The proper usage of titles and the rules and laws governing them was a big interest of mine so I don’t think I am being too pedantic about this topic considering how much misinformation there is and given the fact that there are people that do want to understand how the system works. Someone has to set an example or all we get is this misinformation! Even keep in mind often the American media and even the British media gets this stuff wrong!!! (even a King got it wrong once)*

Here is a quick run down about how to refer to the members of the royal family. One thing many royalty watchers get upset about is the fact that the press on both sides of the pond still call the wife of Prince William (HRH The Duke of Cambridge) Kate Middleton!! The proper way to refer to the wife of HRH The Duke of Cambridge is, simply, HRH The Duchess of Cambridge. It is not Princess Catherine or Duchess Catherine. You do not call members of royalty by their first name if they have a peerage title. For example, its not proper to say “Prince Charles” he is to be called HRH The Prince of Wales. It is alright to drop the HRH and call him the Prince of Wales.

We do not call the Queen, Queen Elizabeth or just Elizabeth, it is proper to refer to her as Her Majesty, The Queen or simply The Queen. Her husband is not to be called “Prince Philip”, he is to be referred by his title, HRH The Duke of Edinburgh. Now if members of the royal family are not the sovereign and they do not have a peerage title, you refer to them by their style Prince of Princess, their first name and the territorial designation they would inherit from their father. For example, Prince Harry is officially, HRH Prince Henry of Wales because he is the son of the Prince of Wales. The Duke of Cambridge was HRH Prince William of Wales until he received his peerage title.

Princess Beatrice is HRH Princess Beatrice of York because her father is HRH The Duke of York. The Queen, incidentally, was born HRH Princess Elizabeth of York for at the time of her birth her father, future King George VI, was HRH The Duke of York.

For those Princes or Princess without a peerage title to be able to use the predicate “The” in front of their name is reserved only for the sons and daughters of the sovereign. For example, if tomorrow the Prince of Wales were to ascend the throne as king, HRH Prince Henry of Wales would then become HRH The Prince Henry. He would be known as that until he is given a peerage title. Also, if the Prince of Wales were to be king tomorrow, the Duke of Cambridge would automatically inherit the titles Duke of Cornwall in the Peerage of England and the titles Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, and High Stewardship of Scotland, which are the Heir Apparent’s titles in the Peerage of Scotland. The titles Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester are not hereditary and would merge with the crown when the current Prince of Wales becomes king. King Charles III would then be able to re-create his son Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester whenever he sees fit. Until then he known by his double peerage titles while in England, HRH The Duke of Cornwall and Cambridge.

That is only the tip of the iceberg. I am sure I will type more about this in the future. Suffice it to say whenever the question of titles and its rules and regulations come up there is often some misinformation which leads to debate and conflict. I don’t claim to be the font of all knowledge on this topic for I am still learning myself. I know a few royal authors that know quite a bit more than I.

Even sometimes the sovereign himself doesn’t know the rules! * In 1947, Prince Phillip of Greece and Denmark renounced his Greek and Danish titles to become a British subject (something he already was, but that is another story) in order to marry the heiress presumptive to the throne, HRH Princess Elizabeth of York. He became Lieutenant Philip Mountbatten (taking the Anglicized name of the Princely House of Battenberg that his mother was from). The day before the wedding King George VI endowed Philip with the style His Royal Highness and the titles, Duke of Edinburgh, Earl of Merioneth, and Baron Greenwich. However, this did not create him a Prince of the United Kingdom as many, including the King, thought! Despite renouncing his Greek and Danish titles (not legally recognized in Britain anyway) HRH The Duke of Edinburgh was not a Prince! But that didn’t stop the press from continuing to refer to him as Prince Philip. I have a book on the royal family from 1951, a year HRH The Duchess of Edinburgh became queen, and it refers incorrectly to the Duke of Edinburgh as “Prince Philip.”

Some say King George VI did this intentionally and that is the point of debate. However, the matter was left unsettled for ten years. Various dignitaries of State suggested titles for the Duke of Edinburgh. They ranged from Prince Consort, the title Prince Albert, husband of Queen Victoria held, to the unusual, Prince of the Commonwealth or  Prince of the Realm. The Duke of Edinburgh himself did not want any elevation of his titles. In the end The Queen, issued Letters Patent on February 22, 1957 giving her husband the style and titular dignity of a Prince of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. He has henceforth been known as His Royal Highness, The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, with the capitalized definite article “The”normally restricted to the children of the Sovereign.

I guess it can get complicated and no wonder titles can be quite the controversial subject!!!